Here’s a little schematic to understand the layout. Help me figure out this mistery, not only to satisfy my curiosity but also to know if the cats in my street are in any danger.
Before reading and to avoid triggering any of you, my cat is fine and he was asking for belly rubs in the sun on my backyard just now.
So, I live in the house with the backyard with the B. My cat occasionally hangs around my neighbor’s backyard too. At curfew, if he’s outside, I come calling and he comes in.
Last night I called him in the backyard at B and he didn’t come but he was replying terrified. I know his meowing and this was “I can hear you, I’m scared, help me”. I couldn’t see him since only my backyard had any light. Every time I called he replied immediately in the same panic. That by itself wouldn’t scare me since he’s very anxious and easily startled. Once he entered the neighbor’s house and got locked in and he was yelling for me from inside the exact same way. But this time was different. The sound came from the outside the house, somewhere around the circle in A. And always from the same exact place. It really seemed he was stuck, he was definitely not budging.
I went around the house through the empty terrain (blue arrow) with a flashlight to see if I could see him and figure what was wrong. As I started moving through the low vegetation I heard and somewhat saw some movement in C in the direction of the arrow. I called my cat again and he was no longer replying. I looked inside my neighbor’s backyard and saw nothing.
I went back into the house. My mother was in the backyard (B) calling my neighbor. She said she saw nothing but heard a huge noise inside the house near the backdoor. The description of the noise sounded a lot like my cat running in panic. After a while looking for him inside and outside we eventually found him hiding behind furniture, peeking very cautiously. It took a while but he recovered. He has no injury or any kind mark of any struggle on his fur.
What I’m pretty sure happened:
- He was around A completely terrified of something and was not budging
- At the moment I entered the empty field whatever C was, it ran from me
- Also at that moment, my little demon flew through the fences and into my backdoor so quick my mother couldn’t even see him and made a huge noise running for his life (as he often does)
What I have no clue and want to find out:
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Most important, what the hell could C have been?
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Was my furry murderer frozen on fear or was something actually physically preventing him from leaving
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How long was he “stuck” there until I came calling him for curfew?
Some relevant information and, since I know some you are against leaving your cats going outside:
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My cats are indoor/outdoor, as most are here, and they can come and go as they please, though mine mostly stay inside and in my backyard. The cat in question explores just a bit more, but not much.
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At night, they have curfew and are inside only, and they know that routine
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It’s a calm street and the cars are slow. Also, for specific reasons my cats are terrified of cars and they even hide when they hear an engine.
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There are no known cat predators here. This is southwestern Europe in a 500k city suburb. There is a small woodland near here which I know very well and the most dangerous thing there is a hedgehog (I actually had one living in my backyard for a year). A fox is very unlikely since I never saw one here. But I have seen foxes in stranger places.
EDIT: Why does every post mentioning a cat outdoors has to be hijacked by the indoor cat fundamentalists? Really, guys? You have the right to your opinion and even to make your argument. But why you have to hijack every post to say your piece for the nth time? It’s annoying as it is ridiculous.
This thread and the “indoor cat” fundamentalists is rich… honestly it’s like hearing eugenics people sometimes.
There are a wide range of options between “indoor” and “wandering mass murderer”. Have the 'murriKKKans here ever heard of walking your cat on a leash? (Like, honestly. It helps so much with preventing them from going to places like Up The Tree, and they can enjoy the outside within a fair range)
Obviously people are fine with cats on a leash ya dingus
Obviously any kind of at least needs to be in a harness not a collar their necks can’t handle the color.
I know it sounds a bit dumb, given everything, but being able to let the cat go wander would be the main reason I’d want to move to Europe.
Where I live we’ve got packs of dogs, coyotes further out, and cars and assholes as far as the eye can see. Outside cats here live to two or three years.
I actually looked into it, but the quarantine is brutal. I just think it’s neat y’all can do that.
Sorry that wasn’t super helpful. You could always try sticking a go pro on the collar.
So can I ask, what general area is this you are referring to, I’m in the woods up here in the US and I have coyotes and bobcats and shit, bears, few mountain lions moving it up north I don’t know if they’ll make it down here but we got a lot of woods. Also a lot of hicks with guns so there is that.
Cats die in the winter here. So we don’t have that. We do have some Siberian Hogs somebody released, Ted nugent.
Keep your cats indoors if you value their health and respect your neighbors
or just appreciate birds.
My neighbor is fine with it. I was also fine with his cat before I had mine. He died peacefully in his sleep at 17 years old, lying in his front porch.
We really need to keep our cats indoors or tied up on a harness outside, I used to let my cat outside too and she also died at 17, but they’re Natural Born Killers and just devastate bird populations, and there are not native in the Americas or australia so the birds get especially slaughtered. Several billion a year they figure in north america.
Australia’s feral cats are going through a rapid growth in size, like they’re getting big. Another couple centuries will be lion-sized out there.
Coddled cats can be afraid of any animal larger than a baby rabbit, it wasn’t necessarily a rational fear. My last cat was afraid of a cat that was afraid of him, both were very cuddly wusses. When they crossed each other’s paths, they’d both be stuck in place meowing at each other for a very long time, and my cat would ask for help when he heard us.
When the other cat wasn’t afraid of my cat, things went differently: the other cat would silently look at my cat for a few minutes to take his messure, charge him, and my cat would go up a tree or come running to us if possible. No long standoffs, just a few minutes of noise (from my cat) and then flight.
Given how long your cat was trapped by this unknown animal, I suspect that your cat’s adventure was probably a non event and that your cat was afraid of something that wasn’t actually aggressive.
Foxes are everywhere in Europe, also in suburbs and cities. They’re just nocturnal and there’s not that many of them compared to house cats/dogs since they have to fend for themselves. Non sick foxes won’t go out of their way to attack adult cats, even if those cats are afraid of them.
Definitely sounds like a chupacabra encounter.
Do we need a separate “Non-American Cats” community, so non-American people can ask cat questions without half the thread being derailed by all this indoor/outdoor argument?
Unless you’re in or around Turkey, your cat is an invasive species that damages the environment. I don’t care what your opinion is on the subject. This is a fact. I’m sure your cat is perfect and never causes any issues though.
You can be fine with letting your cat cause these issues. That’s a choice you get to make, just as you can pour fat down your drain. You’re causing a burden on others, but that’s your choice. You can justify it however you like to yourself, but you’re the human and you chose to have the cat. It’s on you that your cat is an issue.
I live cats. They’re great animals. They’re also not a thing the rest of the ecosystem has adapted to handle. Once your cat is killed/eaten then the ecosystem is healing.
This isn’t even mentioning indoor cats live longer healthier lives. Be selfish and keep them indoors.
Do non American cats not contract FIV, get hit by cars, destroy the local bird populations, and have lower lifespans than indoor cats?
This isn’t about America, as much as you & OP want to make it seem like. It’s about doing the right thing for your pets.
It’s straight up rude to your neighbors as well, regardless of predators or disease.
I raise pigeons and actively trap cats on my property, because I have no other choice. I wish people could just not be so fucking dense about this.
i’ve heard of those people with their pigeons.
What exactly does ‘trap cats’ mean?
Do you kill them?
I’ve someone did that to my cat he’s going the same way, and slow and painful too.Yep, exactly. And when you let your cats roam free, it also has a cyclical effect where it brings more cats to the area. Cats are very territorial, especially outdoors, and tomcats are especially driven to expand their range and territory. It’s super selfish to allow your cats outdoors in just about every way.
There’s no place where outdoor pets are responsible.
Indoor/outdoor argument is universal and for good reason.
No.
Keeping cats outdoors is a huge burden on biodiversity pretty much anywhere and especially in places that are poorly adapted to such predators like Australia and New Zealand. It’s less bad in Europe since foxes and stoats etc already exist and occupy similar niches.
Yes!
With explicit rules against even mentioning this.
Please! It’s insane. Americans are obsessed with locking living things for life. They have no clue how ridiculous they sound.
You chose to have the cat as a pet. If you don’t want to lock a living thing indoors, don’t have a pet. That’s a perfectly fine choice. It’s the responsibility of a pet owner to make sure their pet isn’t causing undue harm. If someone let’s their dog out and go around biting and killing things, that’d be pretty fucked up. Why do cat owners feel they don’t have to be responsible pet owners?
It’s not your place to tell me if I can or can’t have a cat. Stick to your own rules, we’ll stick to ours.
Except they aren’t natural predators, so they decimate local populations. But, yeah, other than that, it’s fine if you don’t care about your local biodiversity.
The only thing my cat decimates is the yearly nursery of mice in my compost bin and I’m thankful for it (though easing on the gore would be nice). The occasional wall lizard too, but it’s rare. I had two dogs before my cats, they killed more birds by far.
I actually have a blackbird hanging on my backyard regularly. Had an hedgehog too. My cats are very happy with their lives and they’ll stay that way. Sure as hell they’re healthier than locked in overweight cats ruining their health with all the stress eating.
You can be as confident as you want. You’re not any less wrong.
Oh, the irony…
I’d like to defend the Americans who keep their cats indoors and strongly oppose outdoor cats. If you live in most areas of the US your cat has a good chance of being eaten by a larger predator. It’s pretty normal for cats to be attacked by coyotes, bobcats, feral dogs, birds of prey and even raccoons. All of those predators and worst of all humans in cars, we have a lot of them and we go fast. I am part of a couple community FB groups and they’ll get a post a week of a dead cat found on the roadside. If it sounds like our roads are just covered with dead animals, you are right. There is death on every shoulder.
Nobody has a problem with Americans, Australians, New Zealanders etc keeping their own cats indoors - and in fact would likely support it in areas where they’re not a native species, or you’ve got dangers like those you outlined - the same as it’s supported in areas here in conservation areas, or areas with rare birds nesting.
The issue is the aggressive, abusive behaviour of those hijacking every thread which has a cat in someone’s garden, and insisting everyone else does the same in countries where cats have free-roamed and been part of the native ecosytem for a few thousand years.
All cats should be indoor cats. Even if there are not predators, they can be and disrupt the local bird and lizard population.
Yes. Cats here should be indoor cats. Even in the city there are raccoons, coyotes, alligators, dogs in people’s yards, and CARS. I let them out briefly and supervised, sometimes, to catch a lizard if they are watching them out the window. Or as others say, occasionally on a harness to wander the garden, and eat a little grass.
Obviously that’s not always possible, there are feral outdoor cats that sometimes show up, the city has a spay/neuter and release program for those.
No! You don’t understand! The cars here drive slowly, and pookums can recognize the noise!
Oh jeez I forgot about gators, we got fuckin dinosaurs hunting outdoor cats in some states.
I live in Maine, the primary killer of outdoor cats is cars #1 followed by trucks then the weather. A little north from me bears, bobcats and lynx become a problem.
Indoor cat owner here… I couldn’t ever find my babies like the poor turtle trying to cross the street… People hit animals
People are the worst.
Yes, I would understand keeping your cat indoors in areas with predators and vulnerable species. There are good reasons to keep your cat indoors especially in places like the US and Australia. Not everything is black and white. There are always risks but when the risk is manageable I prefer to keep my cats happy.
I don’t care about murdered animals unless they’re endangered - you
Feral and semi feral cats are common in many places all over Europe and Asia. Animals killing other animals isn’t murder. It’s manslaughter at worst. And yes, domesticated cats with outdoor access are part of the regular biosphere both in cities and in rural areas in Europe and Asia.
I like straw men, unfounded assumptions about OP, and hyperbole. - you
Sorry my use of the word murder upset you
Enjoy your beheaded birds
“I like endangered species, and I think there should be more of them”
~people who let their cats outside
I get the idea of risks being managed but when the risk is my cat dying an early death I do not think it is ever worth it. I had outdoor cats for most of my childhood when I lived somewhere with less car traffic and a manageable level of risk. The longest my cats ever lived was maybe 8 years, and she’d had multiple run-ins with other cats that left them scarred and beat up by the end.
I just don’t think the danger is worth it when the danger is the premature death of a loved one (cat).
New big neighbouring stray that bullied your cat. Cat often will not move from another cat, and will have staring competition with them, but this time the competing cat might be larger so your cat is afraid but will not budge because that cat will give chase if he run. Cat will often run from any other animal but not cat, they will have a staring competition.
I also vote for this. Once had a cat that went on her first alone outside trip. She likely found a nice place close to some bushes to take a dump when she was surprised by another cat and got scared so much she fled mid shit back into the house. It was a huge mess and she avoided leaving the direct proximity of the house afterwards.
In North America I would guess coyote, in Europe, I would guess a fox or feral dog chased him until he found somewhere to hide from it.
Could also just be another cat. Big Tom cats have a tendency to chase other cats around.
It’s in the suburbs of a major city. I’d be very surprised to find a fox here. I’d very surprised if another cat would scare him that much. He’s not a pushover.
City suburbs are prime fox territories. Where I used to live you would easily see multiple foxes per night if you looked out of the window for 5 minutes. There were many cats about (including our own), and never heard of foxes causing any issues for cats.
It is not surprising for fox or coyotes to be in suburbs of cities.
There are no foxes in this area. Even in older times there’s no mention of foxes in this region. Definitely not coyotes. Most definitely it was a younger cat bullying him.
I’m also in suburbs of a large city. I literally just saw a fox in my driveway between my house and the neighbor’s house a couple weeks ago. There are also periodic reports of a coyote or two throughout the year. They’re not common to see in a more urban area, but they’re usually around somewhere.
I’ve seen a fox and coyotes in the suburbs of Toronto, a major city of more than a million
And in the same neighborhood there is a constant stream of missing cat posters
Years ago while living in the suburbs, I was literally stalked up a quiet residential street at midnight by a female fox. I was walking my large dog at the time, and the fox was barking at him. Turns out the fox was in heat and thought my dog was a good mating option. It followed us for several minutes. It was pretty freaky because I didn’t recognize the sound but I could see something from about 100 feet away. It looked kind of like a small dog, but sounded unearthly.
So basically: foxes can be incredibly bold animals, even in suburban areas. And this theory seems plausible to me.
I also think fox is a prime candidate. Never saw one here and I know the woodland pretty. But I have seen a fox in a larger city and very bold one at that. But why wouldn’t my cat just run back home?
Honestly your cat may have backed the fox down a little bit. If the cat runs, the fox immediately goes into hunt mode and the cat is prey. If the cat stands its ground, the fox might have been debating whether this was worth it or not.
He might not have known exactly where the danger was, so it just sheltered in place and called for help. Or maybe he just got frozen with fear and scared to move at all.
People talk about ‘fight or flight’. But a third instinct - freeze - can also happen.
Either way, I’m glad your cat is okay.
I live in the middle of Kansas City and I see deer, foxes, ground hogs, raccoons, possums, vultures, you name it.
My dog chases my neighbor cats up trees, even though the trees aren’t in our backyard. They could safely leave without interacting with him but they won’t leave until I make him go inside.
There was definitely an animal out there that your cat was concerned about. May or may not have been a predator, but likely it was.
Are you for real?
I’ve met a fox in the front yard of a B&B I was staying at. Not a big city, but still a city.
Oh, I’ve seen foxes in bigger cities. I’m no stranger to foxes. But in this area…not a sign of them…not even in old people stories.
Wildlife in cities is an amazing topic. In my old home town, they had wild boars running wild in gardens and in the cemetry. There is even a photo taken by a policeman who met a wild boar in the cities’ pedestrian zone.
OP is in Germany. You can’t even adopt a cat if it’s not allowed to go outside.
In Australia we are going in the other direction towards cats are indoors only unless you have a completely enclosed outdoor ‘cat run’ kind of space.
They are absolutely decimating local fauna and free roaming domestic cats & feral cats is a big issue in some areas pushing species toward endagered status.I’m from Germany and you can definitely adopt an “only indoors” cat.
nonsense, where the hell do you get your information from? Do you think people in apartments just don’t have cats? Cats are better kept indoors anyways
I live in Germany and have been trying to adopt a cat for the past few years. Every single Tierheim insists on Freigang.
I have an indoor cat now, purely because the cat distribution system got me. Not because a Tierheim thought “hey, maybe it’s better for an animal to live in an apartment than in a fucking Tierheim!”
I live in Germany and had no problem adopting a cat for an apartment, where at most they get to go on the balcony. Your shelters are just weird.
A shelter that insists that a cat must be able to shred the animals in the ecosystem around it to pieces sounds kinda sketchy to me
Not Germany but it’s normal to let your cats come outside as they please (if the place is safe of course).
Keine Ahnung aber labern??? Halte deine Katzen drinne und lass sie nicht in die sandkisten und in den sand unter schaukeln kacken. Echt so respektlos und ekelhaft das man auf spielplätzen erstmal alles nach hunde und katzenscheisse absuchen muss
I was gonna say a Coyote (you’d be surprised how far into a populated area they’ll travel) but then “Europe” and I don’t think you have those, so nevermind (unless your country does have them and I’m wrong, then that’s my guess).
If I had to guess given that, fox or rival cat. Maybe stray dog.
As others said most likely another cat. Could have had yours locked in a defendable spot until you approached and it run away. From your description its most likely a cat. Could have been a stray, just wondering in, or unneutered male.
I’m also starting to think it’s what it was. My cat was very fearless with other cats but that was when he was younger and still had his nuts. Without the testosterone making him brave he went back to his normal self: a very sweet non-agressive and easily startled/scared cat. A cat probably chased him and he was hidden in a safe place not daring to leave until he left too. I’m glad he called for my help and I was there for him.
He was fine, he didn’t even fight. That will teach him not to stay out late. In the end he had lots of love that night. Everybody gathered around the bed where he hid while he peaked for safety. He only felt safe to come out after the other cat came to comfort him and show him it was safe (they are heavily bonded). I gave them a few treats and the next day he was rolling his butt in the grass in the backyard again while I laughed about cat leashes and triggered Americans.
glad it worked out well for everyone 🙂, very sweet
El Chupa Cabra!
It’s nesting season now. Keeping cats outside pretty much means easy and fun hunting on fledgelings.
Now, altruistic feelings aside, in addition to somewhat endangered tits and not really endangered sparrows, there are birds that are totally lethal for cats. Some of those, like owls, are often really hard to spot for an untrained human, for they are very fast and make no noise. Others, like crows and seagulls, are just very fast and devious. And they would totally try to do anything in their power to prevent the hunting for their babies, from instilling fear, to physical damage of various severity (that they could also inflict onto humans, I guess rarely lethal in Europe, but eye traumas happen; I know of conflicts between humans and crows where government had to resort to inviting professional military sniper to settle it. Hunters know not to mess with owls lest they are fine losing their face, literally.).
So this is just another theory that does not require cat predators and quite fits the setup described.
My neighbors keep cats outside; those look scared to death most of time this season - for a good reason, there is an extremely hungry owl family learning to fly here (that only I and people on Fediverse who saw my shitty smartphone pictures know about). Those are an addition to everpresent lynxes, a bear, and at least one wolverine, yet it’s never this scary for them as now, it seems.
Honestly, it’s possible that your cat knocked something over in your neighbor’s yard and panicked. It’d sound like something big and scary, which would cause the cat to hole up and yell to be saved - and then when you came around the corner, perhaps thought that the ‘big scary monster’ was coming without knowing it was you.
